How did you go about choosing psychiatry as a specialty?
PM:I got a master s degree in cardiovascular physiology from Michigan State University. At that time, I thought I was going to be a researcher and use that as a platform for Christ, to show his creativity or find the cure for cancer. But I couldnt stand operating on dogs; Id cry whenever I had to put a dog to sleep after I operated on it. So Ive always been a big softie. My wife was from Arkansas, so I ended up going to the University of Arkansas for medical school. I knew in medical school that God wanted me to be a doctor and use that as a platform somehow to further the cause of Christ. But I didnt know how…I didnt know if Id be a missionary surgeon overseas, a rich American radiologist who served on a mission board, or a witnessing family practice doctor. I really didnt know what field God wanted me to go into, other than medicine. In medical school, you do a little bit of everything.
I really tossed and turned trying to decide what field of medicine to go into. I thought God wanted me to be a surgeon, because most missionary doctors are surgeons. But I didnt really enjoy surgery that much. I loved delivering babies and seeing new life, but I didnt want to be getting called all hours of the night for the rest of my life. I enjoyed reading psychology books even though there werent a whole lot of Christian psychology books back in the 60s other than Paul Tournier and Clyde Narramore. I read of all Paul Tourniers books, and when I did some psychiatry in medical school, I really enjoyed it. I loved understanding how the mind and the soul and the body all worked together. Two weeks before graduation, my medical school buddy, Frank Minirth, and I were praying about what to go into. We thought it would be neat if we could both go into the same thing and be a team.
The Bible says in a multitude of counselors there is safety. We called about a dozen Christian leaders, including Haddon Robinson, to tell them we were considering psychiatry among other things. All of them told us, “Whatever you do, dont go into psychiatry, because everyone who goes into psychiatry loses their faith.With 100% advice not to go into psychiatry, we prayed and decided thats exactly what God wanted us to do. Its ironic that Haddon Robinson later hired Frank and me to teach at Dallas Theological Seminary.
Many Christians seemed afraid of psychology, and yet much of the psychology that Frank and I studied and the psychiatry that we saw practiced was very biblical. We thought it was too bad that Christians were missing out on the possibilities offered by the field. Psychiatry offered us a unique way to minister to people for Christ. Frank and I decided at the same time to go into psychiatry, about two weeks before we finished medical school. We were allowed to go into a residency in Arkansas, and later on I went to Duke to finish up.
How did you and Frank Minirth meet?
PM:At the University of Arkansas, they put cadaver mates in alphabetical order. The person next to me alphabetically out of more than 100 students was Frank Minirth. We shared the same cadaver. I think that was divine providence, even though we are not working together now.
What brought you to Dallas Theological Seminary?
PM:I grew up poor and was teaching at Trinity for $14,000 a year. At that time, Frank Minirth wanted me to join him in Dallas and begin a counseling program. I had some better job offers for over $100,000 a year. I was leaning toward quitting seminary, taking one of those lucrative jobs, and buying a home on Lake Michigan.
Then Paul Little died in a car wreck. Paul Little was a teacher at Trinity during this time, and his office was next to mine. He wrote a wonderful book on How to Give Away Your Faith. I went to Pauls funeral, and Leighton Ford talked about how Paul Little had been a pioneer for Christ. Leighton challenged us: “When you look back on your life, do you want to see how much money youve earned, or do you want to see what youve done to be a pioneer for Christ?It was like a knife sticking in me. Sitting in that pew, I decided to go to Dallas Seminary. They already have a great counseling program at Trinity, I reasoned. Im going to go be a pioneer for Christ. Instead of taking a more lucrative job, I decided to join Frank and teach at Dallas for $12,400 a year. I ended up teaching full time for 12 years.
How did your career evolve into writing and broadcast?
PM:There were hardly any Christian psychology books available other than those by Gary Collins, Clyde Narramore, and Paul Tournier. So for each course I taught, I wrote a book for that course. For example, I wrote Personality Development for a personality course I taught. The books took off and sold. After people read my books, people wanted me to treat them. I had a small, private, part-time practice to supplement my teaching income and help pay off my medical school loan.Take help from telephone counseling.
People began calling from all over the country, wanting Frank and me to treat them, but we didnt have time. We were booked up for three to six months in advance, because we only saw patients about 15 hours a week. We decided wed start hiring some Christian counselors to see the overflow. We hired committed Christians, who were therapists, either psychologists, psychiatrists, or masters level therapists. The clinic in Dallas mushroomed and grew. Then some of those therapists wanted to move back to their hometowns and form branch clinics. Some of the people we trained started their own clinics and we referred to them. If they wanted to do a branch clinic with us, we let them. Then, in 1985, Frank and I were asked to start doing radio broadcasting. By 1989 I had left Dallas Seminary to focus on radio and writing books.
I really tossed and turned trying to decide what field of medicine to go into. I thought God wanted me to be a surgeon, because most missionary doctors are surgeons. But I didnt really enjoy surgery that much. I loved delivering babies and seeing new life, but I didnt want to be getting called all hours of the night for the rest of my life. I enjoyed reading psychology books even though there werent a whole lot of Christian psychology books back in the 60s other than Paul Tournier and Clyde Narramore. I read of all Paul Tourniers books, and when I did some psychiatry in medical school, I really enjoyed it. I loved understanding how the mind and the soul and the body all worked together. Two weeks before graduation, my medical school buddy, Frank Minirth, and I were praying about what to go into. We thought it would be neat if we could both go into the same thing and be a team.
The Bible says in a multitude of counselors there is safety. We called about a dozen Christian leaders, including Haddon Robinson, to tell them we were considering psychiatry among other things. All of them told us, “Whatever you do, dont go into psychiatry, because everyone who goes into psychiatry loses their faith.With 100% advice not to go into psychiatry, we prayed and decided thats exactly what God wanted us to do. Its ironic that Haddon Robinson later hired Frank and me to teach at Dallas Theological Seminary.
Many Christians seemed afraid of psychology, and yet much of the psychology that Frank and I studied and the psychiatry that we saw practiced was very biblical. We thought it was too bad that Christians were missing out on the possibilities offered by the field. Psychiatry offered us a unique way to minister to people for Christ. Frank and I decided at the same time to go into psychiatry, about two weeks before we finished medical school. We were allowed to go into a residency in Arkansas, and later on I went to Duke to finish up.
How did you and Frank Minirth meet?
PM:At the University of Arkansas, they put cadaver mates in alphabetical order. The person next to me alphabetically out of more than 100 students was Frank Minirth. We shared the same cadaver. I think that was divine providence, even though we are not working together now.
What brought you to Dallas Theological Seminary?
PM:I grew up poor and was teaching at Trinity for $14,000 a year. At that time, Frank Minirth wanted me to join him in Dallas and begin a counseling program. I had some better job offers for over $100,000 a year. I was leaning toward quitting seminary, taking one of those lucrative jobs, and buying a home on Lake Michigan.
Then Paul Little died in a car wreck. Paul Little was a teacher at Trinity during this time, and his office was next to mine. He wrote a wonderful book on How to Give Away Your Faith. I went to Pauls funeral, and Leighton Ford talked about how Paul Little had been a pioneer for Christ. Leighton challenged us: “When you look back on your life, do you want to see how much money youve earned, or do you want to see what youve done to be a pioneer for Christ?It was like a knife sticking in me. Sitting in that pew, I decided to go to Dallas Seminary. They already have a great counseling program at Trinity, I reasoned. Im going to go be a pioneer for Christ. Instead of taking a more lucrative job, I decided to join Frank and teach at Dallas for $12,400 a year. I ended up teaching full time for 12 years.
How did your career evolve into writing and broadcast?
PM:There were hardly any Christian psychology books available other than those by Gary Collins, Clyde Narramore, and Paul Tournier. So for each course I taught, I wrote a book for that course. For example, I wrote Personality Development for a personality course I taught. The books took off and sold. After people read my books, people wanted me to treat them. I had a small, private, part-time practice to supplement my teaching income and help pay off my medical school loan.Take help from telephone counseling.
People began calling from all over the country, wanting Frank and me to treat them, but we didnt have time. We were booked up for three to six months in advance, because we only saw patients about 15 hours a week. We decided wed start hiring some Christian counselors to see the overflow. We hired committed Christians, who were therapists, either psychologists, psychiatrists, or masters level therapists. The clinic in Dallas mushroomed and grew. Then some of those therapists wanted to move back to their hometowns and form branch clinics. Some of the people we trained started their own clinics and we referred to them. If they wanted to do a branch clinic with us, we let them. Then, in 1985, Frank and I were asked to start doing radio broadcasting. By 1989 I had left Dallas Seminary to focus on radio and writing books.
